Talk:Kaguya Ōtsutsuki Strikes
Arc names Ok, since the war is technically still ongoing I propose we add Shinobi World War to the title. The Shinobi World War arc mainly focused on the shinobi revived by the Edo Tensei so I decided to go with Impure World Reincarnation Arc. Keeping it as it is now would be implying that the war is over and that the Ten-Tails was revived sometime after the war. Unless we want to group the arcs into sagas I suggest we have Shinobi World War: Impure World Reincarnation Arc , Shinobi World War: Ten-Tails Revival Arc & Shinobi World War: Return of Madara Arc --DuelMaster93 (talk) 19:55, December 19, 2013 (UTC) :First, those names are incredibly wordy; like a Seven Word Title for an arc? Good lord. :Second, Arcs have historically been named for the major event that takes place during the arc, not the backdrop. A classic example would be looking at Dragon Ball Z. Look at the Namek Saga, which was followed by the Captain Ginyu Saga, and then the Freeza Saga. Each of these take place on Namek, yet the idea of "Going to/Being on Namek" was only important to the first part. In our case, obviously the the Shinobi World War was based around, the war. The war itself being important ended with the Ten-Tails thus the Ten-Tails Revival Arc and now that chapter has come to an end with the Return of Madara. :So basically, no we aren't going to rename these articles and shoehorn the World War into the title because by these arcs while the war is still going on they are not the "focus" so to speak.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 20:24, December 19, 2013 (UTC) ::well first of all the dragon ball sagas are grouped into smaller groups such as the saiyan group, namek group, androids group & the majin buu group. My second option was to consider sagas. Just like in One Piece how water 7 and enies lobby are both connected to cp9. same with little garden, drum island and alabasta all linked to baroque works.Also sagas and arcs can have the same names such as the thriller bark saga and thriller bark arc. and the skypiea saga and skypiea arc. Like i said before not doing anything about would imply that the war ended. fact of the matter is that these arcs are clearly linked. The Ten-Tails revival and the Return of Madara are just important chapters of the bigger Shinobi World War. Besides, this is only a suggestion.--DuelMaster93 (talk) 21:31, December 19, 2013 (UTC) :::The decision has been made. There is no need for huge arc names. The Shinobi World War may still be going on, but it is no longer the focal point of the story. Its merely going on in the background. We just got out of the arc focusing on the Ten-Tails, now we're on to Madara, so its named accordingly. ~ Ten Tailed Fox 21:33, December 19, 2013 (UTC) :::: What about "Return of the Ulitmate Evil Arc" Madara appears to be the greatest madman in the story, overashadowing even Orchimaru. 22:40, January 13, 2014 (UTC) Why use "the Ultimate Evil" when you could just use "Madara"?--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 22:50, January 13, 2014 (UTC) Arc's Beginning Shouldn't the arc have technically begun at chapter 655, as that is where the summary starts? KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 22:05, December 19, 2013 (UTC) : The arc begins in the chapter Madara Uchiha is Back. 567. That is when the focus shifts fully to Madara. ~ Ten Tailed Fox 22:09, December 19, 2013 (UTC) ::Technically, Madara begins resurrecting in 656. In my opinion, the break should be 655 and 656. 654 is when the tailed beasts are ripped from Obito, effectively ending the existence of the Shinju, which I was going to suggest as the last chapter of the previous arc, but in 655 there's the talk with Obito about ideals and all that friendship, support, regret saccharine that is so completely end of arc. 567 is when Madara becomes alive again, but 566 is when we actually see him. If anything, 655 and 656 are buffer chapters between the arcs, but one better resolves the previous (saccharine talk) and the other kicks the new one in motion (BW taking over Obito to resurrect Madara). Omnibender - Talk - 01:33, December 20, 2013 (UTC) I am sorry to keep nagging about this, but after careful consideration, I think the arc should start at 656... The arc is called the "Return of Madara Arc". In this chapter, this is when Madara truly returns, as he is alive in the last panel. I think everything after it is more like "Madara's Last Stand" than his return. It's like calling the Ten-Tails Revival Arc it's respected name, however only after the Ten-Tails is revived and starts it's rampage. Also, I think the two-page spread at the end of 655 sort of looks like the end of an arc to me. Also, in 656, this is when Madara truly takes control of the war, as he forces Obito to revive him. These are just my thoughts, take your time and think about it. However, I respect any decision that the community decides. Have a good day! --KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 16:57, January 3, 2014 (UTC) :Can we add a poll for the community to decide on the arc's beginning? --KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 05:11, January 4, 2014 (UTC) ::There is no need for the poll. Arcs don't start exactly at the moment of an event. They start at the beginning of a chapter. Madara's revival at on the last panel brought the end of the Ten-Tails Revival arc. The chapter called "Madara Uchiha is Back" starts the Return of Madara arc.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 20:59, January 4, 2014 (UTC) :::An example is this is the last arc, the Ten-Tails Revival arc. The Shinobi World War arc ended with Chapter #594 with the Ten-Tails reforming at the last page. After that the arc shifted to the Ten-Tails Revival Arc in chapter the next chapter. The action of the Ten-Tails returning signaled the end of the current arc, not the start of the next.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 21:03, January 4, 2014 (UTC) ::::Then based on that fact, I will edit the Return of Madara arc so the first picture and the first paragraph are moved to their right places- the previous arc. --KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 21:18, January 4, 2014 (UTC) "The Final Battle" Headline Change I propose we change the Final Battle headline, as it seems like we are entering the Infinite Tsukuyomi... I don't think the final battle will begin until after the jutsu is broken. --KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 10:32, May 14, 2014 (UTC) :Probably. Omnibender - Talk - 18:24, May 14, 2014 (UTC) ::I guess I should clarify- is the Prelude to the Infinite Tsukuyomi an acceptable title? --KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 22:48, May 16, 2014 (UTC) New Arc? If next chapter focuses on the Infinite Tsukuyomi's activation and it being used on the whole world, then shouldn't it be a new arc? I mean, Madara's goal was to complete the Eye of the Moon Plan, and now he seems to have done it, so should we consider this the end of this arc and perhaps next week create a new one, like "Infinite Tsukuyomi Arc" or something like that? Let's see what happens next week, but this is just a suggestion. --Chrillbill (talk) 18:52, May 15, 2014 (UTC) :It depends on how the series progresses... I don't think we should be too hasty, as the Return of Madara Arc is not that far in yet, and so it would seem very sudden to create a new arc already. --KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 18:56, May 15, 2014 (UTC) ::I too think that it's too early to call it another arc, even if IT happens. What I can see happening instead is, if a great enough portion of the arc does end up happening inside IT, that the arc should be renamed. Omnibender - Talk - 18:59, May 15, 2014 (UTC) ::: Alright, fair enough. We'll see what happens in the upcoming chapters. What would be a good new name for this arc if we get a lot of IT? I mean, a lot of stuff has happened in this arc already so I can't really think of fitting name. --Chrillbill (talk) 19:09, May 15, 2014 (UTC) ::::If a significant part of the arc ends up being IT, let's arbitrarily say, for the sake of argument, two thirds, just rename it "Infinite Tsukuyomi Arc". If not, either keep the current name, or a new, more balanced name can be proposed. Omnibender - Talk - 19:22, May 15, 2014 (UTC) We should just wait and honestly I don't think the fourth war arc should have two or three arcs in it. It already has one that isn't really needed. M a s a s h I never called it separate arcs.Munchvtec (talk) 16:05, May 16, 2014 (UTC) :Of course not, no databooks covering the story beyond Itachi Pursuit Arc, and the reason we don't still call it Shinobi World War arc is because we want to make the arc pages manageable. In an unrelated note, why do you that thing where you put spaces between every letter of a word? It's really puzzling. Omnibender - Talk - 16:31, May 16, 2014 (UTC) An auto correct on my kindle makes me I've said this many times already, I only have access to a kindle sometimes so that's why it sometimes happens. Munchvtec (talk) 16:42, May 16, 2014 (UTC) :Uh, looking up "kindle" in this wiki, not counting the mention in this page, there were only three mentions of it, two in a specific user's talk page, so not exactly many. Anyway, regarding the arc, I agree, we should wait and see how it plays out. Omnibender - Talk - 17:18, May 16, 2014 (UTC) Alright then we wait.Munchvtec (talk) 17:35, May 16, 2014 (UTC) Name of arc I think that saying that this arc is about the Return of Madara was always a sketch, but now that Madara has been incapacitated i suggest a name change for this arc. The current name only reflects the first part of the arc. I personally suggest "Eye of the Moon Arc" or "Infinite Tsukuyomi Arc", or, this being a more methaphoric title, "Infinite Dream Arc". What do you guys think Costeavladalexandru (talk) 15:12, May 28, 2014 (UTC) :I'm in favor for "Infinite Tsukuyomi arc" but we also have to take into consideration over how massive the main characters' articles are becoming and act from that as not to overload them. --KiumaruHamachi (talk) 15:19, May 28, 2014 (UTC)KiumaruHamachi :: Renaming the entire arc would be foolish. The arc centered on Madara's return and flaunting his power up until the last chapter, in which the Infinite Tsukuyomi was finally cast. If anything, it should be split into another arc from here, as the story is clearly shifting focus again. ~ Ten Tailed Fox 15:20, May 28, 2014 (UTC) ::: 4 (or 5) arcs for 1 war? No thanks. Yes this arc is about the return of madara, but just his return wouldn't matter. What this arc is about is his Iplan/I. And making a new arc would mean this arc is very small. The focus didnt change, it is about the eye of the moon. What did change is the fact that Zetsu was revealed to be the actual final villain (for now at least) Costeavladalexandru (talk) 15:28, May 28, 2014 (UTC) :::: It should probably be renamed. Flaunting his power and the like is fine and dandy, but if the real meat of the arc is the Infinite Tsukuyomi, no matter who is the one in control of it, it should be renamed to reflect that. Adding to that, the last arc lasted two years, and the arc before that was also two years. Seems unlikely (and could potentially get a lot more clustery) declaring this arc done after what barely five months?--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 15:33, May 28, 2014 (UTC) ::::: Story arcs don't work like that though. They're only around as long as their plot is around. Madara wasn't even trying to activate his plan until Naruto and Sasuke started getting a tad bit too strong for his tastes. Up until last chapter, nothing in this arc was about the Mugen Tsukuyomi. It was all about Madara waving his wand around now that he'd returned to life. I would never advocate renaming an arc after a plan that has only been on display for two chapters. Sometimes story arcs are shorter than others. And as to @Costeavladalexandru (what a mouthful), the war kinda stopped being the focus when the Allied Forces were rendered fodder and the protagonists started doing all the fighting... which was about two-three years ago. So, yeah. Not really worried about how many arcs you think there should be. The plot is shifting away from Madara, so, if there is a change to be made, its changing the arc; not the name. ~ Ten Tailed Fox 15:59, May 28, 2014 (UTC) ::::::Technically the entire war arcs have been about the Infinite Tsukuyomi. But I digress, if we start breaking arcs into specific battles, we are in for one hell of a time. Otherwise, every individual battle could be classified as it's own arc, hence why this particular arc, depending on how next week plays it, could (and in my opinion should) be renamed to something more ambiguous of a individual.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 16:05, May 28, 2014 (UTC) ::::::: Perhaps you misunderstand me. I'm not suggesting we split off the arc. I only made that suggestion because that's better than renaming an entire story arc after a plot device that has only been present for two chapters, and is already in the process of being countered. That's why it'd probably be best to wait for a few more chapters to make a decision. To be honest, none of us expected this twist, and anything could happen. Its premature and naive to rename the arc or split it off at this point. For all we know, Madara could pull an Obito and resist Black Zetsu's control. The suggestion that Black Zetsu will be the "final villain", is a bit premature on the part of those suggesting it. ~ Ten Tailed Fox 16:09, May 28, 2014 (UTC) While i kinda agree with you, it is still ridiculous to have a 20 chapters arc (or less). If anything, those 20 chapters should either be added to "infinite tsukuyomi arc" or to "Ten Tail Revival Arc".--Costeavladalexandru (talk) 16:11, May 28, 2014 (UTC) Lol at the "being present for 2 chapters" part. The eye of the moon plan was what caused the war in the first place--Costeavladalexandru (talk) 16:13, May 28, 2014 (UTC) : Cause, yes. Focus, no. Its only been active for two chapters, therefore it has only been present for two chapters. Secondly, to suggest that a "20 chapter story arc" is ridiculous is to be ignorant of literature entirely. Story arcs can last anywhere from four or five chapters, to a couple of hundred. They are story arcs, meaning they are dependent on the focus of the plot over a certain span of chapters. The Infinite Tsukuyomi was only a pipe dream in Madara and Obito's crazy little heads until two chapters ago, prior to which, the focus of the plot was the fact that Madara Uchiha—a man who was feared by the world—had returned to life, which he proceeded to use to beat the living hell out of everyone around him, pretty much for his own amusement. ~ Ten Tailed Fox 16:19, May 28, 2014 (UTC) ::Hence why I said both "depending on what we learn next week" and "ambiguous of an individual". Infinite Tsukuyomi, even if it get's countered and what not would be better than a Return of X title. Hell if Kaguya does come back, we could go the Hidan and Kakazu arc route and name it like that. Who knows.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 16:25, May 28, 2014 (UTC) I think it's nonsense to say that the current arc is over and a new one began. There has not been enough plot/events/chapters. This will probably play out like around chapter 400 and something. Back then, just after we had learned the truth about Itachi, and Sasuke was hunting for Killer B, we thought that would be an actual arc, and if I'm not mistaken, we had an actual article called "Hunt for the Eight-Tails" or something similar. Obviously that simply became part of another arc once it became clear that it was just part of something larger. Omnibender - Talk - 22:34, May 28, 2014 (UTC) :I think if Madara is killed or incapacitated, and if he stays that way for the next five chapters, then I think the arc should be renamed or a new arc should begin. --KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 00:49, June 1, 2014 (UTC) Yeah. Madara is officially dead. GG Madara. But anyway we either rename the arc or make a new one now. --Costeavladalexandru (talk) 07:06, June 4, 2014 (UTC) I've got two ideas for a name: Rebirth of the Rabbit Goddess or Eye of the Moon Plan Complete. Thoughts?--Hockey Machete (talk) 07:11, June 4, 2014 (UTC) Both are kinda long. 5 words for an arc? The longest arc names are 3 words. I personally suggest the obvious, "Infinite Tsukuyomi Arc". Either that or make Infinite Tsukuyomi a new arc,starting from 677--Costeavladalexandru (talk) 07:21, June 4, 2014 (UTC) Well, given that the characters most likely not getting out of the Infinite Tsukuyomi for some time, I second the motion to name Infinite Tsukuyomi. Anyone else?--Hockey Machete (talk) 07:30, June 4, 2014 (UTC) You know what? DO whatever you want! But We are currently editing over 5,436 articles and 6,813 images and you can help! That is a total lie. But whatwver. If you want you can make a chapter where madara is dead be in the Return of Madara Arc. But what is next? Listing Pakuun as a sharingan user? Or Kiba as a hokage? This is just stupid. You said i need more discussion, i made a forum post,you closed it. Anyway i am out. Bye --Costeavladalexandru (talk) 08:53, June 4, 2014 (UTC) :Take care, but the topic in the forum was closed because this topic exists right here. :Anyway, yeah now we know Kaguya is back and now raising all kinds of hell, so the name should be changed to something less Madara.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 09:31, June 4, 2014 (UTC) ::@Costeavladalexandru If you're going to act like that, please be on your merry way and don't let the door hit on the way out. Erasing all the discussion on this talk page was also a brainless move. Anyway, agree, less Madara-centric name is necessary. It'll probably be Infinite Tsukuyomi Arc, even if a few characters are released from it, since this is a continental-scale genjutsu. Omnibender - Talk - 11:32, June 4, 2014 (UTC) ::: i did that by accident. I restored i immediatly. I think--Costeavladalexandru (talk) 11:46, June 4, 2014 (UTC) :::Agree that the name should be less Madara too. ~[[User:IndxcvNovelist|'IndxcvNovelist']] →talk • • watty← 11:39, June 4, 2014 (UTC) ::::Infinite Tsukuyomi Arc looks a good name for this article since Madara was planning and struggling to achieve it. —[[User:Shakhmoot|'Shakhmoot']] (Talk) 11:50, June 4, 2014 (UTC) I suggest we will let the creator Masashi Kishimoto decide what the name of this arc really is even though he thinks that the current arc's name is Shinobi World War Arc that started from Chapter 515.So its best we should ask the creator what is the real name of this arc and one more thing this is going to be the final arc and naruto is about to "End" in 2014 as evident with "the final battle" tagline at the end of chapter 673 and "the end begins" tagline at the end of chapter 679.Johnny1234343 (talk) 14:14, June 4, 2014 (UTC)Johnny1234343Johnny1234343 (talk) 14:14, June 4, 2014 (UTC) :Creators don't typically name arcs. In fact they are made purely for simplicity sake for the fans by the fans. As far as the author is concerned, this is Part II of Naruto. Breaking it down into little segments is for fans to make crap much much easier to deal with. So no, we aren't going to ask Kishimoto, not like we could anyway.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 14:22, June 4, 2014 (UTC) I don't get it, what needs to happen in order for his arc to bw renamed? Cause from what i have seen everyone agrees with renaming this arc "Infinite Tsukuyomi Arc". So?--Costeavladalexandru (talk) 16:31, June 4, 2014 (UTC) : i think that the Infinite tsukuyomi arc is a good name also Munchvtec (talk) 16:31, June 4, 2014 (UTC) :: So, everyone agrees? --Costeavladalexandru (talk) 16:39, June 4, 2014 (UTC) How about "Return of Kaguya Arc"? Would that not be a good name? Though Infinite Tsukuyomi has happened already, Kaguya -- during the IT, just like Madara -- during the 4th shinobi world war, is back to the world of the living. WindStar7125 (talk) 17:32, June 4, 2014 (UTC) WindStar7125 ::Cannot have a name. Part of the reason we are having this discussion is because the arc had Madara's name when we thought he would be the primary focus.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 17:40, June 4, 2014 (UTC) :::Damn Kishi. :::#I'd suggest waiting for next week's chapter to see what will happen next, since neither Infinite Tsukuyomi Arc doesn't nor Return of Madara/Kaguya Arc fit as a name :::#Or let the name stay as "Return of Madara" arc then make another arc. :::#I was surprised that we name the arcs. :::~[[User:IndxcvNovelist|'IndxcvNovelist']] →talk • • watty← 17:41, June 4, 2014 (UTC) :::: Why doesnt Infinite Tsukuyomi Arc fit?--Costeavladalexandru (talk) 17:46, June 4, 2014 (UTC) :::::I'm still a little confused here, but this is my reason/opinion. I don't think the genjutsu was the focus of the arc. Majority of its chapter is about Madara's strength. The story's changing its direction already, and Infinite Tsukuyomi Arc wasn't the big deal anymore. It's now about Kaguya's revival. Again, it's just my opinion. :) ~[[User:IndxcvNovelist|'IndxcvNovelist']] →talk • • watty← 17:52, June 4, 2014 (UTC) :this topic really needs to be on the forums, I cannot contribute because of stupid edit conflicts. In short, the arc should be renamed and subarcs should be made for each attempt by Madara and Kaguya. --Speysider Talk Page | My Image Uploads | Tabber Code | Channel 17:56, June 4, 2014 (UTC) :: tell that to the guy who closed my thread about this on the wiki forums--Costeavladalexandru (talk) 17:58, June 4, 2014 (UTC) ::: I'd rather have a discussion like this in a place where all the edits can easily be seen. A very minor conflict inconvenience won't kill the lot of you. Most appear to be in agreement. Who has control of the Bot so we can make this hell easier.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 18:06, June 4, 2014 (UTC) ::::Edit conflicts mean five comments are brought to your attention before you actually make yours instead of nothing indicating they were done. Also, what TU3 said. Bless the bots. Omnibender - Talk - 18:20, June 4, 2014 (UTC) :::::Except I'm editing on an iPad and the fact Wikia does not use a mobile skin means I can't copy my message if an edit conflict occurs, nor can my iPad keep that much data loaded at once. --Speysider Talk Page | My Image Uploads | Tabber Code | Channel 18:25, June 4, 2014 (UTC) ::::::And that my friend, is an iPad problem. Not a Naruto Wiki problem. Again, I would much rather have easily followed histories than the history mess the forums have. But that is another topic for another place. This is about the name of the Arc. So I ask again, who runs the Bots?--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 18:27, June 4, 2014 (UTC) UltimateSupreme has a bot if I'm not mistaken. Omnibender - Talk - 18:28, June 4, 2014 (UTC) :Yeah he has. ~[[User:IndxcvNovelist|'IndxcvNovelist']] →talk • • watty← 18:37, June 4, 2014 (UTC) This situation reminds me of Search for Tsunade. The first part of that arc was about Itachi,while the rest was about Tsunade. But in the beggining of the arc it was known Naruto and Jiraya are looking after Tsunade. So i suggest to do the same thing: 1 arc containing both parts. Maybe there could be a mention that "The first part of this arc is sometimes called the Return of Madara Arc".--Costeavladalexandru (talk) 18:28, June 4, 2014 (UTC) :Don't add your message in between. :In that case, just like you said, at the beginning of the arc, it's been stated that it's about search for Tsunade, so that seems fine. Still about Tsunade. :This arc's more tricky, though. :~[[User:I|'IndxcvNovelist']] →talk • • watty← 18:32, June 4, 2014 (UTC) :: It's not like we didn't know why Madara revived at the beggining. --Costeavladalexandru (talk) 18:34, June 4, 2014 (UTC) :::It's spelled "beginning." Anyway, so everyone considers the "Return of Madara Arc/Infinite Tsukuyomi Arc/Return of Kaguya Arc" to be the same arc? WindStar7125 (talk) 19:29, June 4, 2014 (UTC) WindStar7125 :::: English is not my first language. And i think so, yeah. Maybe except ndxcvNovelist, who isn't sure.--Costeavladalexandru (talk) 19:37, June 4, 2014 (UTC) :I also think this should be renamed Infinite Tsukuyomi Arc or Eye of the Moon Arc. --OmegaRasengan (talk) 22:53, June 4, 2014 (UTC) Has it been decided to keep or rename the current arc (I'm confused with all the clutter)? I say keep it because ever since he was revived, Madara was the focus until the last chapter. In other news, I vote in favor of a new arc starting from Chapter 678 and onwards named "Kaguya's Revival" or something much more creative since Madara has "stopped existing" for the time being. --Questionaredude (talk) 00:31, June 5, 2014 (UTC) I think you guys should try my policy when it comes to Naruto chapters- I call it "The Five Chapter Policy." Before any drastic decisions are made, for instance determining a new arc or if a character is dead or not, wait five chapters and see if it is ever addressed. In five chapters, if Madara is still incapacitated/dead/whatever, then either rename the arc or create a new arc. We still don't know if this is the true end of Madara, even if it appears to be. I just say let's wait five chapters and see how things turn out... Not that my word really means anything, though. --KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 01:19, June 5, 2014 (UTC) Questionaredude, about making a new arc, refer to my previous comments on arc length. Omnibender - Talk - 01:32, June 5, 2014 (UTC)